Talk:Bass pedals

Reason for redirecting

Information contained was not factual. Organ pedals are not called "bass pedals". The stub was too short to be useful (see #2 at patent nonsense). The only synthesizer bass pedals worth mention are the Moog Taurus. The three pages that link to Bass pedals are all refering to the Moog Taurus. Thus this page is redundant.

Please sign your posts on talk pages. Andrewa 08:55, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

I can't really agree with any of this. Numerous manufacturers produced stand-alone bass pedal units over the years. And MIDI bass pedals are still in production from various companies such as Roland.--feline1 14:26, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, and that's the point... It's only Moog who called this type of unit a bass pedal. For the rest of the world, bass pedal would mean one pedal of the pedal board. Andrewa 19:13, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

You are confusing me. The terms "a set of bass pedals" and "a bass pedal unit" or "bass pedal synthesizer" are pretty much synonymous. I am not aware of Moog Music Inc calling their instrument "The Taurus Bass Pedal" - that would clearly be absurd.

Moog called it a "Pedal Synthesizer". [1] —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.204.170.66 (talk) 22:45, 3 January 2007 (UTC).

Again, please sign your posts on talk pages. Yes, the Moog Taurus pedal(board) was quite commonly called the Taurus Bass Pedal on album liner notes and the like (sorry I can't provide a reference, I'm sure someone can). That's what is confusing you I think, and I don't think it's my fault! Andrewa 23:38, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Album liner notes were generally written by drug addled hippies who didn't know a "base amp" from a "symfesizer", so I'd pay that no head.--feline1 10:30, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm, perhaps you wouldn't, but if the albums are notable, then the cover notes are citeable. Andrewa 20:31, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Not if they are verifiable WRONG.--feline1 10:21, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Requested move

From WP:RM:

• Bass pedals → Bass pedal — Plural to singular. —Robotman1974 22:43, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Andrewa 08:55, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

• Oppose move. It makes no more sense than moving pants to pant. Andrewa 08:55, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose - couldn't have put it better myself.--feline1 14:48, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Note that I have not relisted this at RM. It was listed as uncontroversial, which it obviously is not. Unless and until someone wishes to list it for survey, this is just an informal discussion really. But I personally hope it will go no further. In that case there's no need to close this poll, as it isn't one. Andrewa 19:17, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Per WP:PLURAL this should be singular. Tayste (edits) 22:13, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

Proposed tweaks

Two things:

I'd like to change the text a little to clarify that the bass pedal units described here have two key (ha ha!) features: a pedalboard (for which there is a good article to which this one can refer) and some sort of bult-in sound generation device. This would distinguish things like the Taurus from pedal MIDI controllers (which are now more common).

And a minor quibble: I don't think Farfisa made electromechanical organs. AFAIK, all their organs had purely electronic sound generation (unlike Hammonds, for example). I'm open to correction on this, but I didn't see anything to the contrary in a quick web search.

Thoughts? 64.171.68.130 19:56, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Quite right about Farfisa AFAIK too. I'd guess that the person who contributed this didn't do a lot of research, as they linked to a page that doesn't exist rather than to the existing pedalboard, electric organ and electronic organ articles. I've fixed it. Andrewa 05:25, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, I got a little carried away with my "tweaks", but I think it turned out pretty well. Have at it! MrRK 20:49, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

We are certainly making progress IMO. It's a complex story, in that many disciplines not noted for their intercommunication are involved... from drug addled hippies (see above) to pipe organ fans (I note that while one editor said that the pedal clavier formed part of a pipe organ, another has recently changed this to form, accurately reflecting the fact that pipe organs do still exist...!). Actually, some early synth freaks fond of mood affecting substances were fond of pipe organs too, see Tangerine Dream. And of course Dr Moog was a physicist and engineer, and the first synth-dominated album to make an impact on mainstream charts was Switched-On Bach, which was on the classical charts... to the disgust of many Bach fans. So it's no wonder that the terminology was and is something of a battleground. Sorting it all out is definitely a job for... Wikiman! Andrewa 23:40, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

The language is too flowery and makes to many story-telling assumptions (e.g. manufacturers "realised" something, "began" to do something else) - this is not an encyclopaedic style of writing. Vocabulary such as "adjunct" is an overly elaborate way of saying something simple. Also, the useful links to Hammond and Farfisa have been removed.--feline1 10:26, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

If you think you can write better prose, go ahead. "Began" is flowery???

"Adjunct" is a two-syllable word. How that is "elaborate" escapes me, but if you'd rather say "addition" or some other word more likely to be known by high school dropouts, again, have at it.

Any reference to Farfisa at all is irrlevant to this page, unless they did something interesting with pedals. The "useful" link to Hammond was to the dab page which required the user to scroll to the bottom to find the Hammond organ link, which itself is only marginally relevant since this page is not about Hammond organs. If you want to add manufacturer links, Moog and other companies which actually made bass pedals would seem to be a higher priority. MrRK 21:35, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

"adjunct to" - you mean they put 'em on the floor underneath! ;-) Hammond, Farfisa and Vox continental organs all had bass pedals, the Farf & Vox units were often detachable, which led to totally standalone units from other manufacturers.--feline1 22:15, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Meaning of Tune

Feline1, do you own a dictionary? Given the fact that you think "adjunct" is a big word, probably not. Not to worry; you can look words up at Merriam Webster. Here's what they say about "tune":

Main Entry: tune Function: verb Inflected Form(s): tuned; tun·ing transitive verb 1 : to adjust in musical pitch or cause to be in tune <tuned her guitar> 2 a : to bring into harmony : ATTUNE b : to adjust for precise functioning -- often used with up <tune up an engine> c : to make more precise, intense, or effective 3 : to adjust with respect to resonance at a particular frequency: as a : to adjust (a radio or television receiver) to respond to waves of a particular frequency -- often used with in b : to establish radio contact with <tune in a directional beacon> 4 : to adjust the frequency of the output of (a device) to a chosen frequency or range of frequencies; also : to alter the frequency of (radiation)

I refer you to the first part of definition 1, before the word "or", and to definition 4. Apparently, you were only aware of the second part of definition 1, but "tune" was a perfectly good word in this context, and in fact converys more meaning than your choice, "produced" - these pedals could in fact often produce higher frequencies as well, but were tuned (there's that word again...) by the musician to play in the bass range, which is why those musicians called them "bass pedals". Perhaps that connection eluded you.

If you want to quibble over the choice of a word, always check the dictionary first. I won't get into a pissing contest by changing the article back, but please check your facts a bit more carefully before further mutil-, er, editing it.

Looking up "adjunct" is left as an exercise for the reader. (I've always wanted to say that.) MrRK 08:48, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

The most common meaning for "tuning" a musical instrument refers to making small pitch adjustments

Nonsense. When a string is first put on an instrument, for example, it is nowhere near the correct pitch. The process of tightening it to bring up the pitch is called tuning even at this stage. It does not start off as something else and become "tuning" only when it gets close. This is why the non-redundant phrase "fine tuning" exists.

to make it match a reference pitch, or other instruments, or its own other strings/oscillators/etc (as in the "tuned her guitar" example quoted). Since this is the most common sense of the phrase, but not the one intended here (where we are talking about setting the entire pitch register of the instrument), it immediately becomes potentially ambiguous and confusing. Therefore, it's better to replace it with a different phrase without the ambiguity. Similarly, "adjunct" is not a particularly common word and in this instance is a quite obtuse way of saying something very simple. Encyclopdia's are here to be informative, not smart arse or lofty or obscure. Please refer to wikipedia's bewildering array of policy and guidelines for further details... --feline1 10:46, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

"They [...] are usually tuned in the bass range" is neither ambiguous nor confusing. Then again, you mentioned getting confused above as well. Hmmm... never mind that, but I really have to question your level of skill with English if you find "adjunct" to be "lofty or obscure". I also note that you use apostrophes to form plural nouns, you use adjectives as adverbs, and you confuse "to" with "too", so you'll have to excuse me if I'm reluctant to take advice from you about writing. Your observations about detachable pedals on electric organs was, on the other hand, a potentially valuable addition to the article. Why not focus on that instead of making questionable quibbles over wording? MrRK 18:40, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Because, whatever egregious typos I might commit whilst typing comments in a rush, I'm nonetheless right :) Now please behave.--feline1 18:57, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Ah, "proof by vigorous assertion". Who needs references when you have confidence, eh? MrRK 19:36, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

You already gave the reference! You cited a dictionary entry where "tuning" has various meanings. So I edited the article to use a less ambiguous turn of phrase. It's really no big deal. Furthermore, the majority of the analogue bass pedal synths (such as the Taurus) have a knob for "tuning" (= fine tuning) and switch for octave transposition (ie overall pitch register). You can turn their "tune" knob to "tune" them to the bass register.--feline1 19:53, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Would you at least be willing to fix the gaping grammatical error your edit left in the article? MrRK 17:28, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. And... um... sorry being a bit of a snot here. MrRK 23:07, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Hat note about bass drums?

I came to this article looking for information about pedal-operated bass drums. Would it make sense to have a hat-note disambiguation, or am I the only person who would make this mistake? --Kierkkadon ^{talk/contribs} 19:00, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Whatever, I added it anyway. If anybody disagrees, we can discuss it here. --Kierkkadon ^{talk/contribs} 19:04, 24 January 2013 (UTC)