Talk:The Way International

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the The Way International article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7

While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard.

Christianity Low‑importance

	Christianity portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Christianity, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Christianity on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ChristianityWikipedia:WikiProject ChristianityTemplate:WikiProject ChristianityChristianity articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Religion: New religious movements Mid‑importance

	Religion portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Religion, a project to improve Wikipedia's articles on Religion-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details.ReligionWikipedia:WikiProject ReligionTemplate:WikiProject ReligionReligion articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by New religious movements work group (assessed as High-importance).

Beliefs and Doctrines

There are two sections on beliefs and doctrines. The first is in paragraph/summary style and the second is more bullet-like, with separate sub-headings. These sections can probably be combined

I combined the two sections, as well as the section on ":esoteric teachings" since they had been covered in the main doctrinal section Ten of Swords (talk) 23:41, 14 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Whitby House

I deleted the section on the Whitby House. It didn't seem to contribute to the main flow of the article, which was The Way's history, structure and beliefs. It seemed such a minor point to receive its own section Ten of Swords (talk)

Overall, as a former Christian who spent 3 years in the Way of 15 years as an extremely dedicated faithful follower of Jesus and had what can only be described as a strong relationship with God, this particular article is a fair description of The Way.

Now that I practice logic, rational thought, skepticism and epistemology, I take exception to 2 things in this article.

1. Describing John Lynn as a "huckster extraordinaire". As a former Christian, I consider all ministers and priests, etc as hucksters extraordinaires. However, I would NEVER use that term in an article that is intended to be an unbiased information piece. I have met John Lynn and he definitely doesn't take himself very seriously and he has a sense of humor that's second to none. I have found no reference on the web of Lynn labeling him a huckster. Calling him a "huckster extraordinaire" makes it appear that traditional Christians aren't hucksters, which in my opinion they are. Simply refer to Lynn as the leader of Living Truth without labels.

2. Walter Cummins and Chris Geer's reference to their ministries should not be in quotation marks. Whatever one may feel their mnistries are, they should not be labeled "ministries". As I have stated, to me, any Christian ministry is a "ministry". I would never call it a "ministry" in what is supposed to be an unbiased information article. Lose the quotation marks please.

Programs

Deleted the below text from the "Graduation" sub-topic because I couldn't parse it in any way that didn't require both additional information and additional explanation. I don't know the additional information so I can't assist in the explanation. The text seems relevant to the topic in approximately the same manner word salad is relevant to tonights's dinner. In any event, it would probably be good informaition to sort out and re-post. Text:

"The campus which had limited in-house degree granting status because it had been a Roman Catholic Convent and Spa, and The State of IN granted the convent an in-state degree from the Church. The Way assumed this status upon purchase of the property. Emporia had originally been accredited through the Presbyterian College denominational charter. The Way attempted to transfer the accredited Presbyterian degree granting privileges to itself, but was thwarted by the State of KS because The Way was unable to meet the minimum standards required for federal and/or state degree-granting privileges."

Removed the single-sentence second paragraph of the summary because it was both redundant and a direct quote from promotional material.

Added a short paragraph in the summary regarding the 1980's cult scare and their prominent place within it.

The Greachery (talk) 13:45, 20 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Birthdate

There is no November 31. Aetataureate (talk) 21:47, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I was involved in The Way from 1976-1999 and never heard Wierwille's birth date referenced as anything other than December 31st. The footnote to Nov 30 goes to one of Wierwille's books - what's the documentation for 11/30? Rosedale Tom (talk) 21:05, 24 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Passing the Mantle

Regarding Wierwille's post "retirement" title. I was involved in The Way Int'l during the time Wierwille was alive after he "passed the mantle" to Martindale. He may have been referred to at times as the "founding president", but the title that he accepted was "President Emeritus". I believe that after his death he was referred to more often as "Founding President" however. I believe that since the passage in the article is referring to the period immediately after his stepping down, but before his death that "President Emeritus" is proper here. I inserted a footnote documenting this title Rosedale Tom (talk) 19:03, 9 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Criticism and controversies

The content recently added under “Cult status” appears to be old (or perhaps invalid) information. The section, being titled “Cult status,” implies that The Way International is currently considered a cult. However, both sources of information listed are more than 2 or 3 decades old. Furthermore, the part about the 1995 report from the French Commission on Cults links to Governmental lists of cults and sects. On that page, the section regarding the 1995 report is almost entirely a list of criticisms of the report. It even mentions that in May 2005 the Prime Minister of France officially cancelled and invalidated the list of cults in the report. Given these points, the validity of the “Cult status” section is questionable and appears to give a non-neutral POV. Kas585 (talk) 15:27, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

If would be nice to have someone more familiar with navigating French legal documents and archives for better sourcing. Gwen Hope (talk) (contrib) 22:03, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Upcoming addition to sexual misconduct section

Future editors, keep an eye on the outcome of Vozzo v. The Way International et al, a case in SDNY alleging that a fellowship coordinator sexually assaulted a minor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Truthis4thots (talk • contribs) 19:03, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This was settled out of court in 2023. 98.28.116.243 (talk) 23:50, 27 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Christian Biblical Council" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Christian Biblical Council has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § Christian Biblical Council until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 21:49, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Vince McFadden" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Vince McFadden has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § Vince McFadden until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 21:50, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Ermal L. Owens" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Ermal L. Owens has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § Ermal L. Owens until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 21:50, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Harve J. Platig" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Harve J. Platig has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § Harve J. Platig until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 21:51, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Roger Mitler" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Roger Mitler has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § Roger Mitler until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 21:52, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"John W. Schoenheit" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect John W. Schoenheit has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § John W. Schoenheit until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 21:53, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Mark and Avoid" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Mark and Avoid has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 February 28 § Mark and Avoid until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 22:01, 28 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Spirit & Truth Fellowship International" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Spirit & Truth Fellowship International has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 March 1 § Spirit & Truth Fellowship International until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 08:40, 1 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Pacific West Fellowship" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Pacific West Fellowship has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 March 1 § Pacific West Fellowship until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 08:41, 1 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Great Lakes Fellowship" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Great Lakes Fellowship has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 March 1 § Great Lakes Fellowship until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 08:41, 1 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"The American Fellowship Services" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect The American Fellowship Services has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 March 1 § The American Fellowship Services until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 08:41, 1 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Way Cult" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Way Cult has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 March 1 § Way Cult until a consensus is reached. Veverve (talk) 08:47, 1 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]