Talk:Landing at Anzac Cove

Periscope Rifle

Please, someone ref. the invention of the periscope rifle somewhere in this article as it played a very novel and integral role to Australian snipers at Quinn's post. Furthermore someone if they can please start an article on some of these locations in red, and especially include Quinn's post in here somewhere. The periscope rifle article was just created by me so I'd like to leave it to the other editors to proliferate it where they see it appropriate. Great aussie invention! Jachin 15:15, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:LateOttomanFlag.png

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BetacommandBot (talk) 23:37, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Culture

Clearly this even has had a huge impact on Australian culture, and there should be a section to discuss this, and the ramifications that followed.58.106.110.97 (talk) 05:26, 17 February 2009 (UTC) I Agree

babaned232 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.108.78.103 (talk) 09:32, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Copyedits

1. I've added 'predominantly' before 'Australian and New Zealand forces' to para 1 of the introduction because the British Royal Naval Division and Royal Marines are mentioned in the 'Stalemate' and 'Aftermath' sections: e.g. "...reinforcement by the RND" (para 3 of 'Aftermath') and "...the casualty figure was about 8,500 including 600 from the Royal Naval Division" (para 4).
2. The 'Anzac Cove' sketch-map is not displaying its caption - is this because it is a png file, not a jpg? Can somebody more knowledgeable than me sort it out?  24 May 2013

RASAM (talk) 14:50, 21 May 2013 (UTC)

OH G I & II

OH G I has 15,000 men, 42 mules ashore, 2,000 casualties. The Turks also had 2,000 casualties which it calls "an even greater percentage of loss". (pp 196, 199)

OH G II has 3,000 dead of 10,000 Turkish casualties for the action of 19 May, with c. 600 Anzac losses. (p19)

See Bean, p. lvii. A check of Navy records showed that 1,800 Australians and New Zealanders were evacuated ftom Anzac in the first 24 hours. The total loss was therefore greater. While the British official statistics gives ANZAC casualties at the landing (between 25 and 30 April inclusive) as 4,686, a check of the personnel records by the War Memorial found that 6,877 Australians and New Zealanders had become casualties in that period, and this figure did not include British casualties at Anzac. Hawkeye7 (talk) 21:52, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

Controversy

Controversy continues regarding the factual events of the first day of the landing at ANZAC Cove,due to the Australian Government's strict Censorship Rules.Charles Bean,Australia's War Correspondance stated "rule of censorship forbids criticism'so we rely on other eye witnesses such as the British War Correspondant B-General Aspinell-Oglander.In his 1927 official History of the campaign, states that "stragglers(Australian Government forbade the use of the word deserters)from the firing line was so bad the senior officers did not think the beach head would hold'. Other non Australian historians/authors of WW1 also talk of alternate events occurring such as Cyril Falls of The Great War(1959) stating of the ANZAC Landing as almost 'calamity' and of a 'heavy drift to the rear'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.166.134.39 (talk) 13:39, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

The two sources you mention are more than fifty years old. The majority of the sources cited in this article are much more recent, and therefore could be expected to take into account those sources (and past rebuttals to them).

The article does cover "large numbers of unwounded men were leaving the battlefield and heading for the beaches", the artillerymen being nearly driven into the sea, and "if the Turks come on in mass formation ... I don't think anything can stop them." The lengthy quotation from Birdwood includes talk of troops being demoralised and "there is likely to be a fiasco", which is about as near to "almost a calamity" and not thinking the beach head would hold as one can come without using the exact same words. So it's not clear what you view as "alternate events" here.

It's true that the article does not discuss censorship nor any ongoing controversy; but it is unclear to me that any unusual or notable censorship took place regarding Anzac Cove as opposed to anywhere else in WWI; nor that there is or was an ongoing controversy about what occurred. If the latter, what sources discuss that controversy? --Demiurge1000 (talk) 19:30, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

References

Citation Needed for landing site text

According to this page (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-04-24/myth-the-anzacs-landed-in-the-wrong-place/5410252) which is a subset of this page (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-04-25/five-anzac-myths-put-to-the-test/5393750) the troops were landed within the designated landing zone (Naval navigation not being precise enough to have a smaller landing zone), and the actual site was less defended than the site the planners were hoping for.Ocker3 (talk) 07:25, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

There's also the information here (Ocker3 (talk) 07:29, 25 April 2015 (UTC)http://www.abc.net.au/innovation/gallipoli/historical_analysis.htm)

Gday - I'm not the author of the article and cannot really comment on its validity, although it does appear in the body of the text and is currently cited. Pls see here: "They were one mile (1.6 km) further north than intended, and instead of an open beach they were faced with steep cliffs and ridges[11]..." - The citation is "Anzac Cove, The Landings". New Zealand Government. Retrieved 20 January 2014. Given this and sources you pointed out there may well be room to add some discussion into the article about these conflicting interpretions / this myth though I would imagine (although I would hope that there are more sources than just a few ABC News articles for this, perhaps recent books or journal articles on the topic perhaps by Ashley Ekins or Peter Stanley?). Anotherclown (talk) 08:17, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Further to my last I added another ref re the landing site (as the NZ govt website seemed a bit weak as a ref to me). Regardless, I'd still be happy to see a discussion about more recent interpretations of this aspect of the landing included in the article if someone was prepared to draft something. Regards. Anotherclown (talk) 09:42, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Gaba Tepe vs Kabatepe

As far as I can tell "Kabatepe" is the modern name, or at least Gaba Tepe seems to have been widely used at the time of the landing. A quick review of the sources shows it in use in the Australian [1] and the New Zealand official histories [2], Tim Travers Gallipoli 1915 and Les Carlyon's Gallipoli. I imagine there are many others as well. As such I don't think a contemporary guidebook is sufficient to outweigh the usage in such sources, which at any rate probably reflects current naming rather that which was common at the time. Happy to discuss if more reliable sources can be provided though. Anotherclown (talk) 08:20, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

I'm also pretty sure that "Gaba Tepe" remains the common English-language name. It's used in Chris Roberts' 2013 book The Landing at ANZAC 1915 for instance. Nick-D (talk) 08:27, 26 April 2015 (UTC)

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Claimed Ottoman victory removed

It appears this should have never been in the article to begin with. "Inconclusive" was changed to "Ottoman Defensive Victory" by an IP edtor here in August, and I compounded the problem by removing the non-standard use of "defensive" which is deprecated by the infobox instructions. The two facts cited in the infobox "Allied forces established a beachhead" and "Turkish Army temporarily halted further progress" both support the "Inconclusive" result, not an "Ottoman victory". FDW777 (talk) 12:57, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Turkish machine guns at landing

It is claimed in this article that there were machine guns at Gaba Tepe greeting the Anzac troops. This is not true. 27th was one of the last regiments to receive machine guns. 2nd Battalion had non though. What they had at Gaba Tepe was a gun battery. Two Noredenfelds and two old "matelli" guns were at Gaba Tepe and a 75 mm field artillery battery that was positioned at Kanlisirt, about 1.5 km East of Gaba Tepe. Initial rifle fire was very intense and gave the impression of a machine gun possibly. Murat (talk) 20:46, 11 April 2021 (UTC)

Allied Casualties and Losses

Im no expert but the casualties of the allied side dont seem to match up, dont know how to fix it but i wanted to let someone know. 2001:1970:5BA2:8B00:0:0:0:F634 (talk) 19:43, 9 April 2023 (UTC)